J. Phil Thien's Projects

Hello there Retired2 - you will find my reply in my second post asking for help - I would hope this explanation allows us to stay in communication with each other in the future - Howard

Hi all -

Lots of views. But no replies. So I thought I'd try this post again. I hope somebody will take a moment to answer my questions for me

I use 6-inch hose and would like to enter the double-height Top Hat in a rectangular opening. I plan on using a 6-inch HVAC boot. The "exit" is4x10 inches.

I have 2 questions -
1 - how much does it matter if the 6-inch hose enters the Top Hat close to the center vs the top
2 - the area of a 6-inch circle is 28.25 square inches
The termination of the HVAC boot is 40 square inches
How important is that difference

I'd really appreciate if somebody could take a moment to answer my Qs.

Thank you.

Howard

Hi all -

It's been a long time that I've been here!

As soon as there's no snow on the driveway, I'd like to build my Top Hat Double Height Thien unit.

I have a few questions about inlet placement and area opening -
- I want a rectangular opening into the Top Hat rather than a round opening
(I use 6-inch hose)
(I am thinking of fitting it onto a 6-inch HVAC boot)
- How much does it matter if the entry into the Top Hat is somewhat centered rather than at the top
-Because the opening is rectangular, do I make the area of the opening match a 6-inch hose's area
(in this case an area of +/- 28.25 sq inches)
- If inlet placement at the top is important in a Double Height Top Hat and I use 6-inch OD plumbing pipe instead, how much does it matter if the incoming dust just drops onto the "floor" of the area leading up to the rectangular opening and should it "ramp" doward to the opening

Thank you.

Howard

Alan M. - thank you for your answer.

You say "the outlet pipe should be 1/2the diameter(3" in your case) up from the baffle."

Seeing the walls will be 12" does that mean 3" from the bottom or 3" from the top? Sorry to be so thick......

Thank you.

Howard

Thank you Phil.

I like the new idea of 12" walls. But I've got a couple of questions. I'll continue using my existing 6" hose.

1 - my 6" outlet extends 3 inches into my current top hat
with 12" walls how deep should the 6" outlet extend into the new top hat

2 - should my 6-inch inlet be at the top of the 12-inch wall
if not at the top where

Thank you Phil.

Howard 

It's been a while!

I'm about to re-do my Top Hat Thien Separator and hav a couple of questions.

Almost 100% of my output is MDF so capturing the super-fine dust is my biggest issue.
My setup is - Thien Top Hat - 6" hose - 30-gallon fibre drum with 19" OD - Delta 50-850

To re-do my Top Hat Separator using a Rubbermaid Roughneck, my questions are -
1 - seeing my biggest issue is capturing MDF's fine dust is the 44 gallons unit's 24" OD TOO big
(keeping in mind 6" hose and the 50-850)
2 - what is the best slot width in a 24" OD (22" ID) situation for fine dust
3 - the 32 gallon's OD is 21"- does anyone have any experience with this unit's walls collapsing
4 - seeing I use 6" hose - how tall do you think I can make the Separator's walls - 8"? 9" just over the 6"?

I appreciate your help.

Howard in Toronto

Hello Phil et al -

It's been a long time since I've posted here.

Now I want to use the bag tree on my Delta 50-850 and I figure I'll make this Thien Baffle out of 1/4" tempered hardboard.

The incoming hose diameter is 6" and I cut the centre plate's restrictor out. I'll reconfigure the blower's position so there are no curves and everything's reeeeeeeal close together to minimize losses.

Rather than use the downward-facing cone-thing in the bag tree's interior I'm thinking of placing a 3/4" MDF disc to fit precisely in that upper portion and having an HVAC pipe hang downward, extending by half of the pipe's diameter below the bottom of the MDF . Is 6" the right diameter? Or is there a different/better diameter to use?

Do I also extend the pipe upward into the filter - if so, by how much?

Thank you all.

Howard

Hi Galerdude -

Thanks for sharing so many of your photos and the .dfx file.

I've got some questions, though. I don't know anything about CNC or CNC files, so these might be kind of primitive....

Can anyone else re-scale the file or are all the settings locked?
If so, is it as easily done in a pro environment as a hobbyist environment?
In my case, my drum's OD is roughly 19" and I use 6" hose....
Can the file be easily reworked for 3/8" bendy plywood to form the verticals rather than the plexi you used.
Can the file be altered to add another hole to register ALL THREE bottom layers of sheet goods?

Thank you Galerdude.

Howard

Thanks Phil -
I appreciate your help on my earlier post.
I look forward to your help re using the alternative inlets on my bendy plywood top hat.
Thank you.
Howard

Hi Phil -

A 7-question beauty as I try my hand at building a new one this coming weekend......

I'm using 3/8" bendy plywood to form the walls of my top hat separator.
The upper and lower panels are 1/8" tempered hardboard glued into 1/4"-deep grooves routed into the bendy plywood.
I'm placing the separator on a 30-gallon fibre drum and the interior walls will hold it in place.

This past weekend I had big problems letting my 6" inlet correctly into the wall of the bendy plywood.

I'm using this type of 6" HVAC duct for trying this type of result - http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?topic=249.0 to be let into the 3/8" bendy plywood walls.

When I use the software from your site - http://www.harderwoods.com/pipedocs.html
1 - what "join angle" should I enter?
2 - what "lateral offset" should I enter?

But then I saw this on your forum today - http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?topic=110.0 and think it's a great idea.

I can buy the same kind of fitting at Home Depot - http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/17074.0EB041006HD_4.jpg
3 - but I'm concerned about getting the sheet metal to accurately follow the curve of the top hat's walls while having enough meaterial to bolt or screw into the walls

But then I saw this configuration - http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/17074.3TT06HD_4.jpg
I think it has a few advantages -
4 - because the area is shorter I figure I can get it to follow the wall's curve more easily
5 - and I can sheet-metal a small gusset into place for questions 6 and 7

With a 6" round inlet -
6 - should the opening into the separator be an equal number of square inches?
Is the following reasoning sound?
7 - 6" inlet = 3" radius squared = 9" x pi = 28.14 = 6 (this is one dimension of the square opening) x 4.71" for the opening into the bendy plywood's walls to match the square inches of the 6" inlet?

Thank you - I'd appreciate your help before I try this again on the weekend.

Howard

Hi Phil -
Thank you for taking your time to answer both sets of questions.
NOW I can start my acquisition tour and start making the thing!
I'll keep you posted.
All the best.
Howard

Phil -
Thank you for your reply below.

Two more questions - and

Two configurations have given me ideas.

1 - the blower leads directly into the bag tree sort of like this -
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=346.0;attach=710;image
2 - the blower goes directly into a cartridge cartridge filter and omit the bag tree and plastic bag
(I already own a FARR filter from a previous DC mod)
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=294.0;attach=565;image
(with just a piece of pipe or something....)

KEEPING IN MIND ALMOST 100% OF THE PROJECTS I BUILD ARE MADE OF MDF, DO YOU HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ABOUT HOW WELL #2 WOULD WORK

Hi all -

Posted here last week.
81 views later and zero replies ???

I realize I've listed a lot of questions at one go.
I just figured to get em all out at one go rather than squeeze em out in small increments.

I'd appreciate any - and all -and Phil's - comments to get me started.

I copied the original post below the "red pluses."

Thank you to all who care to give me a hand.

Howard

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I'm hoping I can get some answers before I start buying supplies and fittings.

My projects are almost 100% made out of mdf so fine dust is my big challenge.

My DC is a Delta 50-850 on which I ditched the twin 4" hoses and modified the plate to accept 6" hose which goes to my main machines.

My idea is to build a top-hat-style Thien Separator to be positioned over an as-yet-to-be-determined size of fibre drum - I want to put a bag into the drum to make emptying easier.

I'll want to mount the blower directly over the drum and keep the whole thing mobile rather than attach it to the wall.
There are two configurations that have given me ideas. One is where the blower leads directly into the bag tree sort of like this -
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=346.0;attach=710;image
The other would be going directly into a FARR cartridge filter and leave out the bag tree and plastic bag (I already own the FARR filter from a previous mod)
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=294.0;attach=565;image
(with just a piece of pipe or something....)

PLEASE KEEP IN MIND ALMOST 100% OF MY STUFF IS MDF!

So now my questions are -
(1) will a 30-gallon drum be the right size to control the fine dust? Should it be bigger? Smaller?
(2) will the 6" inlet into the top hat work ok?
(3) is the dropslot at 1 1/8" okay seeing my current output is almost 100% MDF and I do get the occasional chunk from the TS
(4) is 3/4" MDF ok for the top-hat's bottom or do I improve performance with 1/4" tempered hardboard
(5) should I still hold things together with all-thread even though it's a top-hat configuration
(6) I intend to buy bendy plywood to form the top-hat - how much does it matter if I run the plywood into grooves in the top and bottom or run the top and bottom into grooves in the bendy plywood

Thank you all for your help here.

Howard

Hi Phil -

Thank you for providing so many of us so much practical information.

I'm hoping I can get some answers before I start buying supplies and fittings.

My projects are almost 100% made out of mdf so fine dust is my big challenge.

My DC is a Delta 50-850 on which I ditched the twin 4" hoses and modified the plate to accept 6" hose which goes to my main machines.

My idea is to build a top-hat-style Thien Separator to be positioned over an as-yet-to-be-determined size of fibre drum - I want to put a bag into the drum to make emptying easier.

I'll want to mount the blower directly over the drum and keep the whole thing mobile rather than attach it to the wall.
There are two configurations that have given me ideas. One is where the blower leads directly into the bag tree sort of like this -
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=346.0;attach=710;image
The other would be going directly into a FARR cartridge filter and leave out the bag tree and plastic bag (I already own the FARR filter from a previous mod)
- http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=294.0;attach=565;image
(with just a piece of pipe or something....)

PLEASE KEEP IN MIND ALMOST 100% OF MY STUFF IS MDF!

So now my questions are -
(1) will a 30-gallon drum be the right size to control the fine dust? Should it be bigger? Smaller?
(2) will the 6" inlet into the top hat work ok?
(3) is the dropslot at 1 1/8" okay seeing my current output is almost 100% MDF and I do get the occasional chunk from the TS
(4) is 3/4" MDF ok for the top-hat's bottom or do I improve performance with 1/4" tempered hardboard
(5) should I still hold things together with all-thread even though it's a top-hat configuration
(6) I intend to buy bendy plywood to form the top-hat - how much does it matter if I run the plywood into grooves in the top and bottom or run the top and bottom into grooves in the bendy plywood

Thank you all for your help here.

Howard